http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEwixA33Css&feature=player_embedded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cbvj03Tr9Aw&feature=player_embedded

Spoiler

Lion-O trains a plant thing to fight and apparently straight up executes a lizard.

 

This is really shaping up to be an Aesop-filled, hammy show with a slight lack of actually interesting plot. :facepalm

 

It's a western cartoon intended for children. How did you expect anything different?

 

Avatar: The Last Airbender. Gargoyles. Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes. Young Justice. Justice League. A score of shows over the past decade have managed to have interesting plots and not be so blatant about their aesops.

Your words are meaningless. Especially since they were talking about doing a lot of things that the old show didn't. As is, I'm giving this a 3/5.

 

Five shows. You mentioned five goddamn shows and you're basing your expectations for other shows - especially one that's a remake of a show from the 80s, a decade where at the end of episodes they actually told you the moral - on them? Really? Shit like Avatar and Justice League were exceptions, not the rule and expecting every other show marketed at children to be like them is a little ridiculous. Thundercats just happens to be like nearly every other show in its demographic.

Also, it's hard to argue that Justice League was intended for children - or at least, the same demographic of children as Avatar or Thundercats. I remember some fucked up and/or dark shit from that cartoon.

/Nitpick: a score is 20.

 

The Ben 10 series were decent, though quality varied from one show to the other. Same for the Fantastics, Kick Buttowski, etc...

I can name more than 5 shows, Fiat. I just wasn't aware you require an entire comprehensive list, though I'll do that if you really want to focus on that point.

Also, as to why I was expecting something better, this interview might be helpful:
http://uk.tv.ign.com/articles/118/1181091p1.html

Sophisticated themes? Focus on the characters? We tend to judge stories here on DLP by the first three chapters, right? Gives us a good sense of the story and the quality, no? How about I apply that to Thundercats (2011)?

Episode 1: Very good starter, excellent characterization and interpretations of the characters.
Episode 2: GNARL REVENGE IS BAD! Tigra and Lion-O switch characterizations, they meet a bad expy of Moby Dick and the twins are cute. Best thing was Jaga's survival and the interactions between Mumm-Ra and Grune.
Episode 3: LIFE IS PRECIOUS! DON'T GET TOO HUNG UP ON THE BAD AND LIFE LIFE TO THE FULLEST! Tigra and Lion-O switch characterisation again and we get the faintest hints of Cheetara-Lion-O. Oh and:

Spoiler

Panthro shows up out of nowhere in the Thundertank, and no one apparently recognizes him.

Face it Fiat. My criticisms are valid.

Doctor Destiny. :awesome

 

Your criticisms are valid, but I still think your expectations are unrealistic. Everything is a sophisticated theme when you compare it to an 80s saturday morning cartoon that existed mainly to sell overpriced pieces of korean-made plastic. More than that, everyone claims their work is going to be sophisticated: it gets more viewers from other demographics (like you) to watch the show than if they'd just blatantly pandered to the kids out there. They usually try to avoid actual sophistication, however, because it tends to be a lot of work for something their 8-year old target audience won't pick up on.

I won't deny that there have been a decent number of objectively 'good' cartoons in the last decade, especially considering that I grew up around a lot of them, but they've always been the vast minority. A vast minority - so vast that Sturgeon's Law doesn't even apply anymore. Expecting a show like Thundercats to be genuinely good, even after a good pilot, is still an unrealistic expectation - afterall, while the animation's better and the toys are made in China now, the main purpose is still to sell shitty pieces of plastic.

 

That's cool, but...

Fuckers making them in China? My heart continues to die bit by bit.

 

Lol, one good thing coming out of the revamp is I've started downloading the whole older series. >_>

But yeah, the morality stuff is a bit boring.

And Lion-O is getting more and more 2 dimensional, to the point that he's comparable to the old(series) one. Which is saying something, as the original Lion-O specialized in corny flat dialogues.

 

Okay, they get big points for whipping out the samoflange gag. Someone's been listening to the old voice actor outtakes. :awesome

No points for Panthro being a twat who needs to eat more fiber, though.

 

So... the King sends his two finest generals... And no one else?

 

With generals like those, who needs privates?

 

Anyone with any sense left in them? Seriously, at least send out a couple of dozen guys or something. I'm inclined to buy what Grune was talking about with Claudius sending them out to die.

 

I'm stabbing these writers in the face. I don't know who's working on the dialogue, but I'm stabbing them.

Still, we got some cool stuff from Mumm-ra this episode, and despite a lot of confusing animation sequences, it was rather good. And no stock-footage for when Mumm-ra powers up! :awesome

 

Heh, a little over fifteen minutes in, a headshot of Mon*Star, from SilverHawks, briefly appears on a viewscreen. :awesome

 

Indeed.

This was a great episode for many reasons but Lion-O making out with his ancestor repeatedly kinda threw me off. :fire

Epic armors, epic fights, epic voice-overs, though there were a few logic gaps... Not bad at all.

 

Meh. Filler chapter with no logic or reason. Why would Tigra be the one helping to fix the tank instead of Lion-O, who actually knows technology. Why wouldn't they send Cheetara to forage for food instead of sending their freaking leader and someone Mumm-ra wants dead? Not to mention the fight between the Duelist and Lion-O was shit. :facepalm

 

This, basically - Especially the part I emphasized, since it's what struck me first.

When I compare the two series (and I have to, that's just how it is), I think about how the current Lion-O is a teen, with a teen's mind, whereas the original had an adult body, but the mind of a (very brash) child.

Bearing that in mind, I still don't think the original would have been enough of a moronic hothead to wager his sword -a priceless cultural artifact coveted by THE biggest villain on the planet- in a fight with a guy known for besting people (no matter their level of skill or the quality of their weapon), and then taking their swords.

This is probably where someone will jump in to inform me that he did just that, and I've merely forgotten in the 25+ years since I watched it. :facepalm

On the other hand, I thought the drifter was an interesting, if odd, character. I may have liked him better, though, at the beginning of the episode, when he was just a bizarre random character. Still, even after he got a back-story, he was kind of strange: A person who felt so hollow they more or less became nearly weightless.

Mostly, I really liked the voice acting for him. I thought Stephen Root did an excellent job.

The fact that the character forged a PoS sword for Lion-O, on purpose, was humorous. They acknowledged that, no matter how legendary a sword maker he might have been, there was no way he was going to craft a decent blade in an afternoon.

They kind of blew that credit when they had Lion-O suddenly realizing that he should fucking dodge in a sword fight, and actually turning that epiphany into a victory, mid-fight, after he was already losing. What, the Duelist never fought anyone that got the hell out of the way before?

I guess they did what they could with a 19-22 minute time slot. Something like that probably would have been easier to swallow as a two-parter, with Lion-O losing his sword at the end of the first part, as a cliffhanger*, then spending the second part getting it back. But the odds of them doing that were pretty low, considering they just started the season (with the opener basically being two parts, even if they were premiered back to back).

Also, I'm an adult. No matter how much the creators of a show like this try to make it tolerable for adults/parents (and, in this case, occasionally play up to fans of the original), it's still a show primarily aimed at kids who, for the most part, don't give a shit about what I've just mentioned.



*Yeah, I loathe cliffhangers and their authors, in fanfic, but on TV you're virtually guaranteed that you only have to wait a week for a conclusion, whereas a fanfic author could keep you hanging on for months or... forever.

Fans of shows that got canceled after end/middle of season cliffhangers, like the live action Beauty and The Beast (sorry, Mom), this is your cue to start bitching.

 

Been watching the season over again, and I have to say I've never seen a cartoon with such potential done so little with it. Filler after filler after filler with interesting ideas that could have been fitted in much better. We're only now getting to the meat of the plot, and we're already getting stupid conflicts and backstories that don't seem to fit with previously implied canon.