Cyrus Black and the Legend of Tyranicus (60k+ words In progress)


http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6886192/1/Cyrus-Black-and-the-Legend-of-Tyranicus

A Darker Beginning: From Orphan to Folk Hero (15k+ words in progress)

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/8132503/1/A-Darker-Beginning-From-Orphan-to-Folk-Hero


Both feature Harry being raised by purebloods. The former will have Grindenwald as a main character, not sure about the latter yet (in response to a previous thread). Both explore the Malfoys, Bellatrix, and other dark characters....and both stories are based on hypothetical concepts that could have happened early in the series that would have altered the course of history.


*Also....I should post this as well.

Some of the beginning chapters were written in a very short amount of time as I tended to write out the chapters all at once (for the most part) as ideas came to me. As a result, you will find some fundamental errors (grammar/punctuation) scattered about along with certain inconsistencies (where a word or punctuation is spelled or employed correctly in one one place but incorrectly in another). While the beginning is still certainly readable, I am not here for you to waste your time in such matters - though if you feel it is necessary I understand. Some of you are right in saying that stories should be edited before posting for a wider audience even if it is merely fanfiction. In this, I was careless and will likely go back at some point to clean it up.

Instead, I am here in hopes that that I can improve my story telling mechanics such as plot weaving, characterizations (both within and out of dialogue), and/or techniques used to avoid some of the story telling mistakes I have made. Also, any ideas or response to the ideas in my stories would be appreciated. In fact, any advice regarding story telling mechanics/techniques would be appreciated. I now understand that I will be criticized and I am open to it.

Thank you for your time.

You are appreciated.

 

Presumably you think they are at least acceptable stories if you are posting about them, so the Almost Recommendable thread probably would be a better spot, or at the very least the Fanfic Discussion subforum.

I'll probably read a bit of them later, but dark!Harry tends to suffer really badly from terrible characterization and unenjoyable versions of Harry, but maybe these are different.

---------- Post automerged at 11:49 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:42 PM ----------

Okay nevermind. Maybe someone else will take a look, but we have, just from the summaries, big problems here.

Arranged marriages? and Powerful!Harry in the summaries. Bad, bad signs. Those are things that make me not even click into a story, because they are almost inevitable signs of bad storytelling for the most part.

Maybe I am wrong, but I'm not willing to risk it.

 

Also you are reccing your own fics. That's the WbA.

 

I am assuming you are the author, since you have the same name. Just from the tiny bit of the first chapter of A Darker Beginning that I started to read, since I figured it couldn't hurt to give it a chance:

Bad signs in the first paragraph. The word sharper is misspelled, and Harry has no reference point from which to judge Hagrid's intelligence or lack thereof, and has no reason to find it odd that Hagrid came to get him.

Really? Harrison Potter is a sure sign of someone trying to make Harry sound more than he is or needs to be, making him sound noble or some other bullshit. Harry is Harry, there is no reason for his name to be changed. None.

Uh... no. This is bad. Really bad. it is unbelievable and uninteresting, and Harry is Eleven. Eleven. He needs to act his age, and this is not it.

Newfound wealth... Perhaps. However, Harry never talked to goblins in Gringotts about his money, in canon, or in this story as far as we are aware, so he has no idea how much or how little money he has, far less how he stacks up against other wizards. Also, Harry being phenomenally wealthy is another terrible Harry Potter trope.

That's about as far as I got before stopping. The story is in the first thirdish portion of its first chapter, a mish-mash of bad tropes, worse fanon conventions, and bad characterization.

I will waste no more time on this. I would go right back to the drawing board and throw it up in the Work by Author for people to look at. It's not that the premise is bad or uninteresting, but the execution is crap.

 

It is easy to hate a story when you are repulsed by the ideas and you have the author itself recommending it to you. Clearly I did not bother editing it much as anybody could point out the handful of mistakes made, but I have shown this story to many people here at Vanderbilt in my creative writing classes and they have had an opposite response...mostly. Harry is in an AU story, and is portrayed as a smarter boy than he was in canon. Harry was not well read in Rowling's series...but a well read eleven year old with a higher intelligence could certainly speak as a calm and collected preteen. I will agree to disagree with you here. Harrison is simply used so that people he speaks to don't automatically assume Harry Potter...in no way is it an attempt to make him sound more important, just a small change that he thought might be effective for his first trip.

Arranged marriages is in the story for the purpose of plot weaving and romantic conflict much later on... You can dislike the idea, but no singular idea is reflective of the quality of the writing itself.


Hagrid had just told Harry of his fame and fortune, he doesn't even speak English very well, and his career is that of a game keeper. If I am Harry, I am wondering why an uncouth game keeper is picking me up if I am the savior of the wizarding world...seems odd at least.

Incredibly Wealthy HP is simply a popular idea in AU that allows an author a certain flexibility in plot weaving depending on his/her story...and Rowling did give Harry enough money to be well off...I do not see the problem in exxageration within an AU story.

Lastly...Powerful Harry Potter is more realistic due to one fact. Rowling claims that while Harry is talented, he survived the killing curse from Voldemort due to his mother's sacrifice. Do you think Lily's sacrifice is the only sacrifice to have ever occurred in the wizarding world? Likely not....thus, only a very powerful wizard, a prodigy, would be able to survive such a curse....with or without a sacrifice...if he was indeed the only person to have ever survived such a curse.

I understand if you dislike the story, but I think you went in with a certain negativity attached to your anticipation...as well as certain expectations in that some basic elements...such as Harry's wealth, intelligence, and power...be consistent with canon. I think in order to enjoy a wider variety of AU, you need to detach yourself form the original text to some degree. Being that these are my first two stories to have ever written...I hope to improve. Thank you for your constructive response.

 

Which means nothing. But cool story nonetheless.

Assuming you posted for reviews. Harrison is, indeed, unnecessary. Also, no preteen speaks like that in the real universe.

Agree here, but it is a very common trope in HP fanfiction. Doesn't matter if you do it well, though.

If you are Harry you are wondering: "I'm a fucking wizard? Waaaaaat?" Making him more book-smart would even increase this factor, not lessen it.

Neither do I, until they start piling up and the story becomes merely cliche.

Considering Rowling herself said this is the first time a mother willingly placed herself between a murderer and a BABY; that said murderer's soul was unstable due to previous horcruxes; and that said wizard went ahead and tried to murder both?

Yes. I'd believe that those are unique circumstances because baby and horcrux.

Then keep writing. But if you post here you will be judged against the quality of writing that is present, and that is harsh indeed.

 

My main complaint was being judged for ideas...quality of writing I can understand and openly accept. I have had a wide range of opinions on the quality of the writing, all of which I take into account. I understand that posting on dark lord potter you are likely to elicit criticism...which is what motivated me to post...but not criticism of the actual ideas. I expected level headed responses with constructive suggestions... i was clearly wrong. The only way you can improve is through constructive criticism, but that is not what I have read.

If we are talking about canon vs fanfiction...harry was not like "wtf i am a wizard " in the first book. I think it is clear he was already skeptical of himself due to accidental magic and later on...the letters. By Diagon Alley, he had accepted he was a wizard and was interested in his past. A smarter child likely would have questioned why Hagrid, a game keeper that could barely speak proper english, was sent to pick up the savior of the wizarding world. I agree to disagree with you here.

The horcrux has nothing to do with Harry's survival, only Voldemort 's. Harry's soul was never destroyed and Voldemort, however unstable, was clearly an incredibly powerful wizard capable of murdering the most skilled witches and wizards. It is dark lord + killing curse vs baby. If Jk said it was the first time a sacrifice had been used under such a circumstance...a mother saving her baby...then fine, but I find that very hard to believe. Mothers sacrifice for their children quite often, and in the wizarding world...I cannot envision any baby survivng a dark lords killing curse under any circumstance unless that child was unusually powerful. If there had ever been a previous war, it is likely either a father or mother sacrificed for their child in attempt to save them...It is niave to think Lily 's sacrifice was the first ever preformed jnder such circumstances. It is not as if Voldemort 's horcuxes made him any less lethal. Again I agree to disagree...perhaps Lilys sacrifice helped...but you would have to be unusually powerful to survive in my opinion...if such a world ever existed of course

 

So I flipped a coin and took the first link.

As for the writing with the author's plot put aside, as per the author's request:

'p-p-please, Master!' is what you want there.

'My patience is wearing thin, Wormtail. I will not tolerate anymore of your lies.'

This ^ sounds better and is grammatically correct. I don't know about anyone else, but people adding fucking s's and z's in Voldemort's speech to communicate that he's added a touch of a hiss to the word piss me off. State that Voldemort hissed the word; don't make his speech into a course in decryption. I don't have the time or patience for that type of shit.

'B-but, my lord'

I'm not entirely sure if the second 'b' should be capitalize or not, but this is how I'd write it. As for 'my lord', when in this format you do not capitalize 'lord'. Now, if you used 'Your Lordship', your capitalize the address, as your using is as such.

'muttered: "B-but, my lord...m-my friends...my frien–"'

You have to put something after 'muttered'. You really have to. Grammatically, you're supposed to you the colon, or so I've believe (anyone is free to correct me, if I'm wrong). I have seen a lot of people use a comma. Still, you have to use some form of punctuation there.

Is Wormtail fucking Ishmael chasing down Moby Dick? No, I thought not.

whaling: the practice or industry of hunting and killing whales for their oil, meat, or whalebone

wailing: giving a cry of pain, grief, or anger.

'Enough, Wormtail!' and enough said.

'your lord'

This is as discussed above.

'gasped: "G...G...Godric's Hollow...m-my lord...Godric's Hollow."'

As far as I know, '..' does not exist.

And we have one long ass run-on sentence with a sever lack of punctuation. Sorry, but I'm not a cryptologist, nor do I wish to be one. This sentence is one that sets my eyes skimming, as I don't real care to read and then reread multiple sentences for continuity - hence skimming and not actual reading.

As for the rest of the first chapter, there were plenty of other writing mistakes that needed to be cleaned up. The above are merely the errors that I caught in the first scene of the chapter with a quick read through.

This part, however, stuck out to me in particular, as Harry is fifteen months old, not five with an actual grasp on the English language. A baby does not think like this. They think, yes, but they don't have the brain capacity to fully grasp all of what is and has happened around them. He'd have some sense that something has caused him discomfort and that something has happened to his mother. He'd probably understand that it was 'this man' who was the source of both his discomfort and his mother's stillness, but the connection would be weak and somewhat vague.

tl;dr: While the author doesn't appear to be entirely incompetent, as there is detectable potential from what I read, there are many problems with the writing and the overall premise of the story (which is cliche).

 

Why is this thread not in WBA?

If I were encountering your story out of the blue, this line from your author profile would have turned me off you and your stories. Not only does it belie your claim of the work being "in progress," but it also evinces a lack of maturity as a writer (your needing feedback to continue, your probable passive-aggressiveness in quitting when not receiving said feedback) that nine times out of ten will show up in your writing. None of us are good enough to scold our readers and expect that our stories will be read.

Nevertheless, I did read the first chapters of your stories in the interest of providing some feedback. A few points of suggestion (possibly covered above--I didn't read the others' comments in detail):

You overuse cliché plot devices. When adopting a well worn trope, ask yourself what purpose it serves in one's story. Take blood adoption--why would a mother grieving for her husband agree to erase the most profound record of his existence? This seems incredibly callous on both Lily's and Sirus's parts. After all, in canon, Sirius loved Harry as a son without any silly blood adoption. He even made Harry his heir. (Incidentally, orbus in your adoption ritual's name is probably incorrect as it implies that Harry's an orphan, whereas he has a living parent in Lily.) Yeah, I get that you want him to be a Black for reasons revealed in the next chapter, but Harry was already Black by blood (his paternal grandmother) and didn't need an obscure, overused-in-fanon rite to make it so.

You have clunky dialogue in spots as well as a distracting tic regarding how you handle stuttering/uncertainty/whatever. "W-w-what..." is annoying when employed to excess, like nearly every time you use dialogue tags. As a general rule, try reading your characters' speech out loud. If it sounds corny or clumsy, rework it until it doesn't. Spend time listening to how people actually speak and try to capture a sense of naturalness when you write.

Also, you use too much melodrama when your characters interact with one another. People's mouths seldom "hang wide open" when presented with a minor shock. 'Erupted,' 'screeched,' 'said desperately' should be used sparingly. You don't need an adverb modifying every instance of 'said' no matter what your high school English teacher may have told you.

Another, more serious matter is that you employ big walls o' text to provide info dumps in the middle of the narrative. This is lazy writing and does you no favors. As an example of what I mean, consider the following from the first chapter of your first story:

The stuff I put in bold indicates things happening in the story. The rest is a big, steaming wad of backstory that you hurled at the reader's forehead. Do you think any tension remained from the first, bolded paragraph by the time your readers made it to the last?

You do this a lot. Another example from the second chapter:

The adage "Show, don't tell" is a good one for a beginning writer. It's more gratifying for a reader to be able to suss out for themselves what motivates characters from their interaction with the world and their responses to events as opposed to just being told straight out. The former injects mystery, maintains tension, and generally leads to more compact and compelling writing.

I encourage you to take advantage of the Work By Author section of the DLP boards to work on your mechanics of storytelling. People will be more constructive there with their criticism than on the main boards since it's what WBA was designed for. (That said if you aren't actually after help and merely want people discussing your stories in some sort of misguided attempt to beg praise off the community, then, well, I hope your skin is thick...)

 

Thank you perspicacity....You were actually quite helpful (more than you know) and I will clip and save this in order to improve my story telling mechanics.

I think most people should know that when writing a 5k - 10k word chapter within a couple of hours ...that has not been edited.... and meant purely for practice and obviously not publication, very basic errors can be made without really thinking about it. Pointing those out as if I were a first grader is not constructive. Just to let anyone know if they actually want to help...I have a minor in English at Vanderbilt...I know the English language. On the other hand, I'm a raw beginner as far as story telling is concerned.

Perspicacity was rather helpful...the rest of you acted as if you were Stephen King or some shit. The idiotic audacity is mind boggling.

I was told to come to dark lord potter if I wanted helpful criticism and incredibly... only one person here was actually helpful. I would encourage more authors to come here...but honestly I cannot do that as I'm rather surprised by this site. Being my first time here, I was not sure where to post this...but regardless it is obvious very few on this site are out to help you at all.

FYI...there is a difference between simple errors that anyone could point out and actual writing mechanics...as far as story telling is concerned at least.

 

Clearly you don't, because you're still improperly using ellipses everywhere.

Actually no, I'm seeing at least three other posts pointing out the flaws in your story here.

Then you should do some damn research and look at the rules that are posted everywhere.

 

As has been mentioned, the best writing help from these forums will come from WbA.

That said, the best help in terms of "how" to best tell a story is found in threads where people actually give a damn about the story. When someone shows up who no one knows, who doesn't care about this forum, hasn't taken the time to read the rules or lurk long enough to understand the general way things work - shockingly, the people with the best commentary may not give a damn, and ignore them.

Or, like Pers, post anyway and give them a chance.

Honestly from what you described - writing 5k-10k a day, splaying your brain all over a page and "there are just errors okay?!" - I'd recommend a beta reader more than anything else. I used to write that way - the first 80-90k of Unlocked Knowledge is exactly that, and there are confusing bits where I accidentally a word or two because I was thinking three scenes ahead - and a beta will really help you.

WbA can act as a sort of beta, although I always preferred to use it as a post-beta. But what DLP is best used for is to bounce ideas around. You seem to like overused cliches. That's fine, many of them have been used to great effect; superb effect, in some cases, by authors around here.

Harry of a different name? The only story I don't roll my eyes when I see that is about a little boy named Heinrich (Prince of a Dark Kingdom).

Brother who Lived? Hello Santi.

Time Travel? Nuhuh and Joe turned it over and made two of the best.

Come to think of it, some of the best stories by DLP authors are inverted cliches. But using them improperly makes them boring and dull.

And using stilted dialogue? God I hate this. READ YOUR DIALOGUE ALOUD. Act it out in the shower, turn off your music in the car and build your Harry Potter fanfiction scene on the drive in to work - immerse yourself into your god damn characters and make those lines/reactions/facial expressions make sense. Not overblown, not stilted, realistic. I want them to react exactly like they would if I were sitting across from them having that actual conversation with them - anything less is awful, and is legitimately my biggest gripe with fanfiction.

And I agree with Pers about infodumping. Real writers use talking heads (hi Hermione!) to avoid this. I know you've invented marvelous things to explain this delightfully evil world that JK Rowling never fantasized about in her worst nightmare, but the way you tell it is more than a bit tiresome.


Also - and don't take this personally - you could be an English Ph.D. at Oxford and I still wouldn't care, and I'd correct your writing just the same. If you want to impress us with how great of a writer you are, show don't tell.

 

If anyone could point them out, why are they still fucking there?

 

You being a newbie is understandable. That is why you probably should have played around, skimming all the different forums that DLP has to offer, before posting any story. The reason why people are being negative about this or at least one of them - is the fact that your stories are posted in the wrong forum.

One more thing: Belittling DLP members and telling them to stop being arseholes, they have a right to be. People get very ticked off when someone new comes around and fucks up their sandbox.

So, if you want more negativity and/or whatever people are willing to dish out, my suggestion is to: Either remove this thread and post in WBA; Or ask one of the mods, very nicely, to move it for you. Because this is as out of place as a porno mag in a Christian bookshop.

And, coming back to telling the other DLPers off - These people have been writing a for a lot longer than you have. Hell, some of them are accomplished authors, even. Trust me, dude, these people are the best you can find to beet the shit out of your story and help you knock it back together again.

 

kmfrank covered most of what I was going to say. "Great minds" and all that...

Even Soul Bonds.

To the OP: I'm glad you found what I wrote to be of value.

I think it's fair to say that everyone is genuinely trying to be helpful in pointing out your stories' issues, both structural and mechanical, and sharing their general impressions based on what they've seen. While our community is not the most polite bunch, you won't find folks telling you your stuff is the shit when it ain't (unlike the kind of "LOVE IT! MOAR!!" feedback one tends to receive on fanfiction.net). Tough love. Niggling, avoidable errors do tend to distract the reader (enough of them turn readers off entirely) and one should refrain from posting stuff to fanfiction.net until it's in final draft form.

We all understand that fanfiction is a hobbyist's endeavor, however folks around here are proud, take the writing craft seriously, and appreciate like-mindedness in this respect. While you may have written your chapters quickly and casually, your Cyrus Black and the Legend of Tyranicus is nearly two years old, leaving plenty of time to go back and fix those punctuation mistakes, typos, awkward phrasings, etc.

Also, as an aside, it's worth remembering that several of the DLP community have advanced degrees and/or have published professionally. If you choose to stick around the community (and I hope that you do, as I think you could gain a lot from the feedback you'd receive), your academic credentials alone are unlikely to impress as much as you might think.

@Sesc: Fair point--thanks for the reply.

 

Thread is a clusterfuck.

Can someone summarize what we're allowed to criticize and what we aren't?

 

Kmfrank-

Thank you, some of that was very helpful - employing the use of talking heads, real characterization in speech vs stilted, beta through WBA, etc.

Perhaps I should have perused the site to understand how things work, but I will say this as I just mentioned to another user - civil discourse is far more effective than reaming others.

Also, there are plenty of sites on the web to post your story in order to impress...Dark Lord Potter does not have that reputation and I certainly did not come here with that intention.



Doctor Whooves-

You are right. I was being careless and though I hate to say it....lazy (as far as grammar and punctuation is concerned).

 

The problem Vandy is that such "silly little errors" are not silly and not little. There are hundreds of thousands of stories out there and millions of novels. Nevermind all the tv and video games and music people want to but haven't got around to listening to yet.

Such silly little errors give myself and everyone else a reason to belief you are a fundamentally lazy writer. If you can't be bothered to correct the silly little errors why should I believe you willt take the time to properly plot a story, create satisfying character arcs and interesting situations. And if I have no reason to believe that why should I bother spending any time on your work when there are so many other things out there deserving of my time and attention.