I agree completely, Tinder.
The characters just don't seem to mature. Harry loses his godfather, and being the REAL teens that most FanFic authors are, they include a decent bit about his guilt. Harry doesn't seem to show any guilt or sadness in the beginning of HBP...just the slightest bit when he hears about thw will.

Then the fluff with Ginny is cut down to i think only two scenes together (thankfully), but nothing is really shown. JK also plays up Ginny's role as the one who wears the pants, what with all the hands on her hips and lecturing. Then he breaks up with her, but one can tell that she will force them back together as the final ingredient in the sappy plot to rid the world of that lovely Dark Lord.

I agree with your statement that the characters don't grow up. Malfoy is the only one that does, actually taking his job seriously and getting the gist of it done (getting the Death Eaters in). Harry doesn't even seem fazed in that he has to kill the most powerful person alive, and seems to take it in stride that he has to find some way of destroying the Horcruxes and use LOVE of all things to kill the evilest man in the world.

Too much sappiness and immaturity make it unbelievable, which is why i love the scope that FanFiction affords us. You can go from the sappy canon-esque stuff like the H/G fics to downright nasty with Vash's fic.

Uh...bad rant. Bad. Nothing to do with the thread. Shit.

 

I don't suppose you'd like to elaborate?
I was talking to Dragon, so nevermind.

 

Why should Harry have felt guilty? And Draco took his task so seriously that he half assed it until finally just pussying out, real maturity there. He's only alive because Dumbledore told Snape to go ahead to advance things to the next stage (by finishing Draco's task). I don't think they were less mature than most their age, or even most 20 somethings I know. People are retarded.

 

first I agree HBP had only two characters in it. Tom Riddle and Draco Malfoy. The rest were just cardboard pop ups. "Pull the tab to see InsaneJealousBitch!Hermione confound McClaggen and conjure birds to peel the flesh off Ron's...okay let's not pull the tab then."

*turns the page*

"Harry could feel the monster wanting to kill Dean."

Pull the tab to see the monster in Harry's pants kill Dean and then swallow Ginny whole!


Anyway, Neville is quite obviously so much more hardcore than even Harry is. Check this out:

"Neville, we've maintained the illusion too long. Mr. Potter is starting to suspect something is amiss, and he has to keep the Dark Lord's attention focused on him till the end without knowing it. His Occlumency skills are absolutely abysmal so there's no chance of telling him the truth. I think it's time we undid the memory charm Lockhart placed on you when you were a baby. It's the only way you'll be ready in time now."

Neville stared at the headmaster, aprehensive. He knew how painful that would be, to relive the Cruciatus and watch his parents being tortured by Bellatrix and the death eaters. But the headmaster seemed to think it would also force open the pathways in his brain that led to his magical core, something which had stunted him magically all his life. When he found out he had thanked Ron personally for breaking his wand allowing the idiot to fall on his own sword. He had his own wand this year, which had helped him a bit, but his apprenticeship to Dumbledore was something no one knew about, and if he could survive the removal of the memory charm he could have some hope of defeating the Dark Lord as the prophecy fortold. But not even the Headmaster knew of his and Luna's secret research into the killing curse, as Neville had never completely trusted anyone except for Luna and her father.

"I'm ready." he said, putting his game face on. "Do your worst, Headmaster."

The old man looked at him sadly. "Then let us hope you will walk away from this, and obtain the power you should have always had at your disposal."

Neville's now magically amplified screams were nearly too much for the headmaster's wards to hold in, and most of the people in the castle felt a sudden twinge of fear, pain, and helplessness as Neville relived the loss of his parents for the first time, a scene far more horrific than any of his classmates had witnessed, including Harry, he realized.

Neville had always felt a bit...disconnected from his own body. And now that he was finally whole, physically and magically anyway, he felt freedom. Memories rushed back to him, many things he had already lost track of and his enchanted notebook would have had to remind him of came back to him instantly. It was as if he had been a prisoner inside his own brain, and now he was free to do whatever he wanted, go where ever he wanted in his own mind. He felt guilty for feeling this freedom however, when his own parents were still trapped in their own minds, unable to even see him when he came to visit them. He would avenge them. And he would protect Harry and the rest of his friends, both from Voldemort and from Dumbledore's plans to sacrifice them like some of his twisted brother's sheep. Outwardly, Neville looked sadly at the Headmaster, who was shocked by the outburst of power that had been locked up in Neville, waiting to be released.

"Headmaster. I think I'd like to be alone now. If you'll excuse me."

"Of course. I'll give you tomorrow. I'll expect you back at the Department of Mysteries on Thursday, though."

--

yep, there goes the real hero of the story. Canon Harry isn't a wizard in any sense of the word. Just a moron waving around a bit of a stick. And most of the time canon Ginny or Hermy is leading him around by that stick. Some people are idiots and still accomplish a whole hell of a lot through sheer hard work. Harry just stumbles through everything, surviving purely on luck, which in this case translates as 'the author isn't done with you yet, so she's letting you live and come away smelling like roses.'

 

Plot holes in the HP books? No way, that's almost as crazy as DD giving Veritaserum to Sirius to see if he really betrayed HP's parents...

I thought they actually were growing up until this book...

Harry goes from fearless leader to Ginny's slave. I don't know about you, but if my dead father's best friend, who also happens to be my Godfather died because of something I did, I'd be upset enough to warrant more than 2 lines in the 3rd chapter of the book..

Hermione goes from smartest witch of her age and the only reason Harry and Ron haven't failed (if their school habits are as bad as JKR writes them) to insanely jealous girl who seems to revert back to a 13 year old.

Ron is still Ron. Supposedly Ron "grows up" in this book according to JKR's interview with Mugglenet, yet he dumps Lavender because she's too possessive (becomes jealous because she sees Ron walking out of his bedroom with Hermione.... How do you think Ron would've acted if he saw Harry walking out of Krum's bedroom in GoF). I just don't see where he grows up, except he somehow gets one of the more popular Gryffindor girls to go out with him.

What's the deal with the love potion? It's shoved in our faces yet as far as I can recall, there's no mention of anybody having it used on them.

On an unrelated-from-the-book-but-still-pissed-me-off note, I decided I wasn't going to buy book 7 and would either borrow it from somebody or download it after that interview with Mugglenet, she said Hhr shippers were delusional because she dropped hints about them all through the books. She dropped hints about Ron being infatuated with her, she never returned the feelings AFAIK, yet in this book Hermione is madly in love with him and only wants him (we all know how that works out IRL).

 

NOOOOO! i accidently picked ron. but i agree. naville is alot better to save the world than harry any day. i mean everytime there is danger he escapes either of help or just pussys out. The only book i ever liked in the chamber of secrets. atleast when harry is facing the giant snake he doesn't freak out like normal kids do and run like headless chicken. jeeze if only JKR took the books more seriously and with alot more going on like dragonlance stories or forgotten realms stories then the stories would sell even more so than that. but then when can a women resest a cute pre kids with a bit $$$ reading HP books.

 

I'd hope he'd know better than to insinuate that his best friend is a homosexual, and in a relationship with an apparently hetero famous Bulgarian star seeker.

Anyway, completely right. I had extremely high hopes for HBP. I'd have loved to see JKR write a battle-hardened mature Harry who is in training to become more powerful. I didn't want to see Harry angsting about Ginny and how Ron would kill him if he dated her, and I certainly don't about Harry chasing Draco's ass about. I mean, shock, Draco isn't on the Marauders Map. Ok, that means he is in the Room of Requirement, Hogsmeade or the Chamber of Secrets. Well, he can't be in CoS, he doesn't know about Hogsmeade tunnels so...

All Harry had to do is to wait until the git came out of the RoR, petrified him, and then Crucio'd the git until he told him what he was up to. That, or Harry seems to have a penchant for stealing things from Snape - veritaserum anyone?
Neville might be a cowardly git, Ron might be a jealous git, but Harry's still the biggest git of them all.

 

true, true

 

I agree on the whole Draco thing, and even that Harry is a git, but what do you mean battle-hardened? There are no 'battles' in the wizarding world except like at the DoM... they're wizards, not soldiers. Practicing his magic makes sense, but the final 'battle' is going to be Harry v Voldie, one on one, and we've known this forever. That pisses me off more than HBP... ff's that have epic battles and wars going on. It doesn't fit in the HP universe. If you meant something else by battle-hardened, sorry for the pseudo rant.

 

your wrong. JKR just never show it. the majority of the people that even buy the books are preschool kids that says $$$on the back.
besides who do you think hit wizards are, there equvelent to muggle soldures. there is a whole world out there that JK never showed. your just thinking on what they show you. what about what they don't show you.

r

 

Sorry just had to add this about cervus's post way back on the first page about shooting pink hearts. All i could think about is Harry Potter dressed up like Sailor moon with full transformation thingy then yelling what ever it she yells before massive pink heart of doom destroy's Voldy, then finishes with a fan service pose.

 

I'm not wrong, she doesn't just not show it, she doesn't even imply it. She makes it clear that during the 'first war' it was basically Voldie and DE's, who no one could necessarily identify (since they, as Hagrid mentioned, could be friends or family even and everyone was suspicious), sneaking around at night. If there were battles going on, it wouldn't be hard to identify ppl, and if Voldie showed his face during the height of his power, people wouldn't be afraid to even say his name. They operated under secrecy and creating fear with precision attacks, like all the dead and missing in HBP that they mention. They didn't say Bones died in a battle, they didn't say Ollivander was abducted by Voldemorts troops, these things happened cloak and dagger like. Hit wizards are government assassins, and Aurors are cops, there is no wizarding army even fort godsakes. There are no troops. The wizarding world is too small and individuals are too powerful (due to magic). If they had full scale battles, they'd wipe themselves out in every war, and they wouldn't be able to hide. Voldie and co are terrorists, not a military, and the ministry is police/swat and politicians. The Order is a vigilante group. None of these groups are big enough for that, and Rowling makes it pretty clear.

 

Actually, yeah, I guess I used the wrong word for that. I just meant, Harry goes through all that hell at the DoM, watches his godfather die (Listen, H/G Writers, I don't give a crap how many times you have Ginny tell Harry it wasn't his fault, it was, even if very slightly.), finds out about a prophecy stating that he has to kill, and then the Wizarding World labels him as the Chosen One. One might think its time to grow up now, nay?
And you are pretty much right - there are barely any battles in Wizarding World unless they have an ulterior motive. Example, DoM, the Death Eaters fought them to get the prophecy. Example, battle in HBP, they were mostly there just to kill the old fool.
I guess by battle-hardened I meant a Harry that takes control and uses Dumbledore for suggestions instead of orders. I'd just find it interesting to see how a writer like JKR would do that, and who would stay in Harry's sphere of trust, and who wouldn't. Would Ron be able to keep up? Would Hermione be able to take a Harry that isn't almost completely reliant on her?

 

there are many assumptions going on. for all i know you could be right about that. no one knows because itès impossible. ok maby not impossible just different.

 

Yeah, Rons a dumbass. The poll said "ROn, the boy who made out with Lavender Brown."

Well, meaning no offense to all Lavender fans out there, but Lavender seems a vain. She goes for the popular ones, and uses the, o boost her own. As Ron had just been in the spotlight with Quidditch, she latched onto him. I have yet to see a great fic with Lavender when she's not totally OOC.

 

I voted for neville he just kicks so much freaking ASS

And people are saying that ron's first jealosuy (vocally anyways) was GoF. In PoA he bitched about how he should have got the maruaders map because hes the brother and how Pig sucks.

Neville actually tries to do stuff yea he gets his ass kicked in DoM but remember he didnt have a proper wand. And for dropping the prophecy he was holding it Post-Crucio and with a broken nose and hes a klutz.

Ron lost to a BRAIN that he SUMMONED HIM SELF

 

shit! did he really summon a brain. do you think JKR is really telling us that ron is an idiot. that he really needs a brain..

 

OotP 797 american version

GOD DAMN HES AN IDIOT

 

LOL. his idiotsy is beyond that i can't even think of something

 

Neville is cool. He's almost a squib like magically, clumsy and nervous. But he ahs a kind heart and when it counts you can depent on him to be there.

Ron is is a nice friend. He will stick by you and help you. However he is also prone to fits of jelousy that can be pretty hard on any friendship. He's aslo lazy, a little retarded (Accio brain... come one) and more then a little whiny.

Given the choice I would choose Neville anyday.

Just a thought but maybe he called the brain to him because he was hoping to add to his own meager capacity.