Newcomb it's not pressing but I would like an answer to the Goldilocks question.
Regfan I'm not seeing anything in my notes about you talking about owner in particular, could you link me/talk about it?

 

@Koallas - I've actually not got around to elaborating on Fable/Owner/Vaimes yet, I'll link you when I do.

Not quite sure what to make of Fables attitude around the Fonti/Vira discussion, it feels overblown and manipulative? to a degree. Hoping to get a better grip on it when I ISO him, might give me a better idea of his head space.

My only real concern with Jan so far is his early scum read on me, I'm willing to concede that the lack of solvingness inside his pre-game play isn't alignment indicative given his reasons for not doing it are believable enough and I find a lot of his posts between when I was phone posting with him on the train on Friday night to now an improvement so the scum read there is really weak.

 

Koalas

When I use the term Goldilocks here, I'm taking about how certain interactions between two players are just almost never w/w.

It's hard to articulate exactly the quality, but it's essentially "these two people just do not both know they're on the same team." When scum are talking to partners, there's always always always some kind of agenda there. Usually having to do with making it look like they're not partners. It leaks through as either kind of terse, empty questions/thrusts, or it's overdone and comes off as potentially theater.

The fonti/Vaimes conversation about Miner fairly early is a great example of a conversation that fits perfectly into that middle category of just... organic. They're two people talking, but they're not so easy talking to each other that there's zero paranoia there (you see some of it from Vaimes->fonti). Vaimes is slightly guarded, fonti's more confident, there's some depth and nuance to their comments on Miner.

Picture a world where Vaimes and fonti are both wolves here. That conversation just... I don't know quite how to put it. It doesn't happen like that. It just doesn't. A conversation like that when you're w/w is a juggling act and that went on too long for one of those balls to not have been dropped.

 

I like Delphines reaction towards Jans read on her inside Post #641, the thought process and consideration of TMI feels very much like an angle I think she'd not take as mafia. I'm growing more confident on her being town here.

Koalas - Your reads inside Post #642 lack a stance on Miner, you state that you think Owner & Miner have some similartieis (I'd agree) but does this mean you've got a scum-read on Miner? Some thought process shown here would be nice. Would also like some explanations behind the town reads on Kai and Fluff inside Post #646. Your stance on Rubicon/Jarizok/Myself would be appreciated too.

Don't see how they're related at all? I think "being stressed" and "actively lurking with zero reads stated but popping in solely to make Fonti look worse" are very different things, the latter has a lot of scum motivation here given the situation he's in; if he's scum with a kill power type thing he could be lurking until he can use it if the focus doesn't vanish from him, if he doesn't have kill power as scum he can just lurk and if focus goes away from him, awesome and if it doesn't he's limited information for us to analyse to catch his partners; it's the same way he responded in TH7 as mafia.

---------- Post automerged at 06:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:30 PM ----------

I like and agree with Newcombs point about Vira inside Post #654; makes me feel even better about both of them.

And with that I'm caught up on the newer posts.

 

Gotcha. Goldilocks is one of the better terms I've heard for that.

 

Sometimes I read Newcomb's posts and think "That's something our lord and savior Eidolonic could have posted".

 

I'm very confident on all of Jarizok/Atum/Vira/Newcomb/Delphine being town here, would actually be massively surprised if there's scum in there; gone into these reads in detail already but if anyone wants me to go over one of them again let me know.

Got really weak town reads on Waco & Fonti at the moment too but both are based on fairly weak-ish logic.

Still very confident in Miner being mafia here and think lynching the pile of Miner/Fluff/Rubicon has a very good chance of hitting 2+ Mafia here.

Really hoping to get a better idea on Jan soon, I was anticipating having a really strong read on him early on here and thinking I'd not have an issue identifying him if he's town given his last few games here and his game at MU recently. I've not disliked much outside of his initial scum read of mine but I've not seen anywhere near enough of what I'm expecting yet which is concerning in it's own right.

Alright just got to go through that trio now.

Newcomb - How long do you think till you're completely up to date? I might pop out and grab some breakfast if it's going to be a while and we can talk then.

 

I like this look from Delphine.

W/r/t the bolded though; aside from that early little thing, characterize Reg's game for me overall. Because, like...

Agree with Point 2 pretty strongly.

Setting aside optimal play / not optimal play, following a rigid plan of claims really is just... boring and lame.

Like, no one in this game is just going to randomly Leeroy someone, I think? So just let people rock&roll.

I think Miner/Rubicon are unlikely to be knowingly on the same team, for reasons I've gone into. I wouldn't call it a lock read, but it's moderately strong. Short version, I feel like the way Rubicon was soft-defending Miner wasn't really leaking any of the self-awareness of how bad he'd potentially look later in the game if in fact they were both wolves.

Sadly, yes.

Think Point 3 there is a pretty decent one.

I'd also agree that I'm coming out of reading your post not thinking it's a slam dunk case at all. Rubicon's posts kind of.... it feels like there's a thin layer of glass separating me from Rubicon's mindset, and when I try to read his posts my hand just slides along it and skates for a while, is the best I can put it.

---------- Post automerged at 04:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:43 PM ----------

I'm on 532 right now, might stop at some point for dinner.

Give me a couple hours?

 

To give us a starting point, I agree with your townreads except for Jarizok. I agree that Atum/Vira are very very town, and I'd add Vaimes to my pile of that level of town. Delphine I think is town but not in that group.

I share a weak light town on fonti, and I have a weak light scum on Waco.

Should give us a good jumping-off point.

 

Couple hours works for me, gives me time to pop out for food and get back in time go through Vaimes/Owner/Fable and post my reads/thoughts on them. Also gives me some time to mull over a few thoughts.

 

Jarizok advocated for self-immolation on the basis of it proving a scumread on fontisian (which was incorrect), on D1.

I'd say that "jumping the gun" is a pretty fair meta-dart to tag him with.

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Flattery will get you everywhere.

 

All I can see when I read miner is 'flailing'.

Time and time again when I'd come to a miner post I just couldn't understand the reasoning for it from any alignment. Early I wasn't thinking too terribly about it but it wore thin the longer it went on.

I understand being off balance from fontisian coming straight out the gate at you but take a breath and get your head in the game not continue what fonti's on you about for another 12 hours. If that posting continued I'd be confident in throwing a vote that way.

That said RL was quoted so I've kind of given it a pass in my head until miner returns. Its all you can do.

fluff and Kai are not town reads. They're ever so slight town leans and, honestly, there's not a whole lot of not-gut between them. I find trolly Kai to be slightly AI of him and HF is just so unapologetic about keeping to his approach from Auction.

Thoughts on Rubicon/Jarizok/Yourself.. and Waco/Fable are working their way out. There's a lot of content I'm still gumming over, especially in terms of mindset.

 

oh, I mis-interpreted that then.

I thought Fable was poking at me for saying Jarizok uses too many words in his posts.

 

Koalas, think Vira has nail on the head here. Jan's played with an abrasive/antagonistic edge before as town, I know I've run afoul of it (Hannibal Mafia amongst others).

Newcomb read comes primarily from the fact I really haven't seen much from him that's outside his scum-range. Even with some of his longer posts, I get more of a snipy feeling that a serious push coming from him. The longer it goes with this feeling, the more he's going to drop for me.

For you, don't have a note as to why, but I had you lower in my early readlists, but have gradually moved you up.

Delphine- I feel the talk of the bible stuff being dropped without request is dis-ingenuous, people had been kinda done with them for a while before they stopped. I just haven't had a hard queue on Delphine yet, and I've seen more meta cases than anything

 

You know better than that

---------- Post automerged at 08:07 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:03 PM ----------

I disagree, I think they're unaligned. If they're w/w that'd mean Fable first reaction under pressure in a no flip was to take a kinda blatant swipe at a partner, when there were softer targets? Doesn't fit to me

---------- Post automerged at 08:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:07 PM ----------

Anyone around have thoughts on Kai?

---------- Post automerged at 08:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:09 PM ----------

Actually since I don't think I saw him in your wall, Koalas you do it

 

Can’t remember if you’ve said it before, but can you go over it again or point me to a post of yours? Waco and Font have just read null to me.

What did my game ever do to you?

Kai is posting, so I consider that a victory for the world.

 

Was kinda looking for a bit more than that...

 

It's hard to give a bit more when Kai mostly communicates in pictures.

I'll look at his posts.