Vote Shadow

 

Can we lynch shadow, eh.

 

tom became a wagon because we were annoyed that Muz wasn't explaining his townread on tom "because he's not in contention". So we voted him. lol.

 

Amusing.

 

I mean, Cobalt's argument is literally "Shadow's not a wolf because tom pushed him on day 2"

Like, uh, yeah? Why would you not bus Shadow there? He was clearly getting lynched sooner or later
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To be clear, that was the reason for my vote. I can't say the others.
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Also I'm not sure what you're saying here. I was just saying, if you clear Kai for the Jari vote, do you clear me for mine, and do you clear Mplus? Because then you'd be left with Fluff basically. What are we misunderstanding?

 

No, I remember the circumstance now. It was amusing.

I guess this depends on Cobalt's claiming plan. If Manasi turns out to be the Fanatic there is uh, a significant problem with tom bussing shadow at that point.

 

The question is kind of irrelevant now because uh I'm not really considering any non-Shadow options
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Hm?

The role stuff is kinda over my head but uh I'm glad that whoever you are you're able to sub in and immediately understand it all perfectly

 

You're misunderstanding how process of elimination works. Just because everyone else does it doesn't mean the thought loses its validity.

 

No I think the misunderstanding is something else. What is your point? Do you think I'm disagreeing with you that Kai should be cleared for it? I was just asking you who you think it is if Kai is clear. Because your logic for clearing Kai seems like it'd rule out a few other suspects. Unless you're saying you don't think the same logic applies elsewhere?
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to be clear, I meant "what is your point" as a 100% legit question. but i don't think there's any way to say "what's your point" without sounding snarky. but i really am asking because i don't understnad.

 

Dels, if Manasi is the Fanatic she would know she was checked. With two out of four eliminated I feel like a coven of tom/shadow would probably avoid trying to bus in that circumstance.

I think we should take clears one step at a time. Not everything is as straightforward as "you made a case on Jarizok, you're cleared". Kai is different in that he didn't provide much content and the content he did provide, his impact, so to speak, was mainly to lynch Jarizok. As I understand it, anyways.

Trying to compare everything simply as "Kai bussed Jarizok, but everyone else did" makes it less complex than it should be.
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Regardless, why are you telling me fluff is my only option? Don't we have another option suddenly available to us, shadowlancer, who definitely did not bus Jarizok and is coincidentally on your list?
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Nevermind. I retract that.

 

No, of course it's not that simple. I can't speak for my own Jarizok interactions, but I do admit Mplus made a crucial vote but not a case, and that's different.

I was just asking if you felt the same way about the others or if there was more to it? And I guess the answer is "yes"

I agree with you that I don't think Kai was bussing but that's much easier for me to do now that I know there is an option on the table

And I just don't really agree that tom wouldn't bus shadow. Even if Manasi knew she was checked at the start of the day. (which isn't necessarily confirmed)

Like, why would tom ever, ever try to save Shadow? It was clear that almost the entire game (besides Cobalt) were against him. You have to bus, don't you? tom couldn't stop a Shadow lynch/kill.
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Because that discussion started before Shadow became an option. Now that he is, I continued the discussion just for the sake of it, but I said it didn't matter as much anymore.
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I'm just not accepting "Tom pushed Shadow day 2!" as a reason to not lynch Shadow, when Tom explicitly avoided pushing Shadow on day 1. Which is, uh, the day that matters more.
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also lol if cobalt's a wolf who realized that we'll buy literally any story he spins and is just taking back the peek on shadow just to get that lynch in
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but also can i please have an "i told you so" about cobalt's ridiculous oracle claim lol

i'm aware he wasn't scum and those of you saying "i don't think this is a scumplay from cobalt" were correct for the right reasons as well, but man i was starting to feel crazy the way that oracle claim was clearly bullshit and yet people were like "nah it's fine"

 

Hm.
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I dunno Dels, two questions.

Do you think tom would be able to win a game on his own?

And do you think tom would think he would be able to win a game on his own?
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This is fairly esoteric because we don't know if Manasi is really the Fanatic, I guess. We should take a day off.

 

I don't think they matter, is the point. The chance of saving Shadow is, like, 0%. The chance of winning on your own must be above 0, right

But to answer, well, I don't think tom would've been able to win on his own, no, but do remember that day 1 he wasn't a major suspect and even the first half of day 2 we weren't really looking at him yet

And would tom think he could? I don't know him that well but tom doesn't strike me as the type to worry about if he can or not, he just does his thing either way. I think he's pretty confident in his abilities though, yes. He often talks about how unreadable he is.

 

No. He's my pet townie. Go away.

 

Well, I think it still applies whether he knew Manasi was redpeeked at the start of d2 or just halfway through it. He'd still have the decision to make.

Cobalt argued that tom wouldn't bus shadow after learning of the redpeek from Fonti.
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cobalt ilu but this vote is not moving >_>

 

Ok, flip the question.

Why does shadowlancer bus tom? Work this with me, what is w!shadow doing getting FPS cleared by a villager and deciding to use this credit to put tom back on the lynch list anyways?

He's got everything he wants and is in a good position to yell at people, and uses it to bus tom?

 

If I were the Oracle and Shadow was my check, who would your next highest suspect be?

: D
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^This pretty much.

Nothing from D2 Shadow being cleared said "I'm a witch, what is this villager doing but okay I'll bus my teammate." Lol.

 

Well first of all, Shadow knows the oracle claim is a lie.

He therefore assumes it's some sort of FPS and, since Cobalt isn't a (complete) maniac, that it'll get retracted at some point.

And once it gets retracted... well, he needs something good on his resume at that point, doesn't he? and/or tom somehow doesn't get lynched day 2 after all and then Shadow does and the distancing clears tom?

But I'll go back and take a look at exactly when Shadow started pushing tom - if tom was already the clear lynch for the day or not.

 

I proposed Tom and Fluff.

If Shadow were a wolf, you think he'd bus Tom there when I was smelling Fluff's blood all game?
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You're jesus toasting.

On a good ol' dead site I played on called Jesus Toast Mafia, the act of jesus toasting is to look so hard at something that you see things that aren't there, like when people think they see the shape of Jesus on their slice of toast.

 

Dels, is there a place in mafia theory where you don't actually have to bus your partners to not get lynched?

You're moving from "to acquire towncred I must always lynch my partners" and I'm not sure how a wolfteam doesn't really self-implode from that eventually. Uh. Yeah.