No.

My issue with this kind of drivel is the idealization, the picture perfect of courtly love, of the pairing in question that fanfic authors in ASOIAF like to present. It's always love at first sight. It's always prophecy this, Robert-bashing that. Always and always the same inane repetition and mangling of everyone and everything. Robert is always bashed. Lyanna is always in love and in the right for eloping with a married man and they are almost always 'married'. I am sick and tired of it. I am sick of this shit being perpetuated throughout the fandom. Because it's never just one sentence or one paragraph about how Jon's the son of Lyanna and Rhaegar. It never is. There's always more to it.

And by God, I've had more than enough.

Look, I don't hate Lyanna because canon-wise there's shitall known about her to hate.

I hate the way that fanfic authors tend to portray her and Rhaegar together. I hate how there's little in the way of remorse for the huge shitstorm that stems from their foolish actions, the dozens upon dozens of thousands who died and even more were crippled, wounded and maimed in a various assortment of ways.

I hate how some like to portray the majority of the main cast in the setting as suddenly understanding, providing they're not Robert Baratheon, of the two eloping together. I hate how they never factor in the smallfolk, who'd probably turn against Rhaegar for what he's done with his impulsiveness. The Faith Militant would be the least of the Targaryens' problems by the time the whole thing was over.

I hate it even more when they make Elia Martell nothing more but an accessory, a thoughtless sack of flesh that follows her husband's whims, and of course because she's Dornish she should totally be alright with her husband acquiring a lover, flaunting her like that or bringing her to court along with her bastard that he sired, because it's not like she got a personality that would contradict that, so why bother establishing a bit of backbone, a bit of Oberyn-lite in her behavior?

I hate it when they butcher characterizations in such a way, simply to accommodate their own wish-fulfillment re-imagining of the whole situation.

You've read "A Dragon in the North", I presume? That quest has a Lyanna who went with Rhaegar too, but only for a tumble or two in the hay, and no more. She tried going back, but Rhaegar and his friends, rape-enablers in white, didn't let her. They kidnapped her. Rhaegar raped her. And Jon Snow was born.

It is very much a story of a Lyanna willingly fucking Rhaegar (at first) that I've never hated. I might have the odd burst of irritation against some of its playerbase, because of how foolishly they voted, but hatred or anger aimed at it? None whatsoever.

I've come across several more stories where Jon was the son of Lyanna and Rhaegar and I've enjoyed them, because there was not much in the way of trying to give background to those two idiots or how they got together. There could have been, and so long as it was presented in a somewhat sane fashion, I could have bore and endured it for the sake of the rest of the story.

 

I'm not saying what she did was right. Yes, authors tend to ignore what her actions caused, but there's nothing wrong with depicting Rhaegar and Lyanna falling in love.

Don't get me wrong I hate the idea as much as Odran, but it doesn't kill a fic for me. I personally want GRRM to reveal that Rhaegar kept Lyanna against her will.

---------- Post automerged at 01:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:09 PM ----------

Fanfiction is going to be like this until GRRM gives us more on the subject. Another example would be in Harry Potter before HBP Snape was always written as a pureblood who lived in a mansion, but then it was revealed to be the opposite. The Rhaegar/Lyanna stuff we see in fanfiction is going to be considered gospel by most people until we meet Howland Reed and learn more.

But most of what you said I agree with, but it won't ruin a fic for me. The one thing that does ruin the fic is when Elia is a willing accomplice in the whole thing and becomes like a sister to Lyanna.

But like I said man, write us a one shot or something on how you think it went down.

 

Nah. Already got one thing going on and that's enough for me.

Like I previously said, I'd rather not write about something which I never even liked to begin with.

 

In her defense, Lyanna was 14, and Rhaegar was this otherwordly, beautiful man. What can I say, the kids like the shinies.

I was discussing this with my friend a couple days ago. He was panning some of Daenerys' decisions, but he watches the show, and can't really understand the fact that she's fifteen or sixteen. Nobody makes the best choices at that age, least of all martial decisions.

Back on topic, though, I loathe Rhaegar, not Lyanna. The man was an idiot - he could have cooked up a thousand excuses or worked something out legally from his position as crowned prince. I thought he was a well-read man, bent on his prophecy, but he was also a bit of a coward. Let the realm bleed and let innocent men die instead of poisoning his dad, kidnapped a girl from a noble house without warning and then absconded to Dorne. He's a cockroach.

 

I don't see why it's relevant whether she was willing or not will have no major impact on the story

 

Any fics in modern setting that don't suck impressive amounts of cock?

 

Only the ones that suck stupendous amounts of cock.

 

Well, there's that.

It's a short humourous one-shot.

You might have read it already, I think it was recced some time ago.

 

Yeah, literally the only modern fic I've read in this fandom.

 

What the Dornish do by GlamorousIndieRockandRoll

One shot about Sansa and Oberyn, and the way he influences her. Only around 10k words, very well written and rather interesting.

 

I hardly see how this is better than San/San.

 

While I have no qualms with a well-written San/San, I see we have differing opinions on what constitutes very well-written.

That wasn't bad, but it certainly wasn't very good. I'd put it at a couple mehs above meh. And once a toilet was referred to as porcelain.

 

To be fair! Brandon Stark's decision to ride to the capital and call out Rhaegar to come out and die for taking his sister was the catalyst in starting the war; if he had never done that, then He and Rickard Stark would not have been killed, and the Rhaegar/Lyanna situation could have been resolved without war.

 

I sincerely doubt it could have been resolved without war.

Look to the history of Westeros when betrothals get broken, look to Aegon V and his children marrying for love, how much that fucked up relations between the lords of the realm and the Iron Throne.

Look to Lyonel Baratheon and his short-lived rebellion.

Before Rhaegar did his thing, the high lords of the realm might have been willing to displace Aerys in his favor. But after he pulls that shit, they'd just see him as another madman. Lyanna would have been seen as a stupid child, at best, if she'd gone willingly and most likely married off to some minor lordling in the North whom Rickard would have to bribe extensively because she was officially soiled goods as far as Westeros was concerned.

 

I see that Odran has Lyanna down as an honorary Tully.

 

Anyone know of any good Jon centric fics where he doesn't go to the Wall? I've already read all of DeloriousEdditors fics, Snowfall, and Squire/Knight of Dragonstone.

 

There's not many. What I do know, is that someone needs to write a good story where Jon is actually Ned and Ashara Dayne's child (instead of the probable lyanna/rhaegar thing), and Jon pursues the vacant Sword of the Morning. I wrote a start to one, but I don't really have the time or skill to see it through properly.

 

From what I remember of the timelines it's more likely that if Jon is the son of Ashara Dayne that his father would be Brandon. Preston Jacobs has good videos about it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-u2gUM4Vvc

 

It's in the works, based mostly off of the Quest-that-never-was, A Song of Sand and Snow. It's not a priority, though.

 

To Go Forward is a Jon Snow Peggy Sue. It's not great but it doesn't suffer from any of the common flaws of ASOIAF fanfiction which means it's better than the vast majority. It's also nice that he's proactive, not an angsty loser as he's usually shown.
Jaska The timeline doesn't work for Brandon and Ashara primarily because he'd be four or five months older than Robb, which is enough to be evident. Brandon dies well before Robb was conceived.