Alright, I think I'm going to put this to a stop before everything falls apart.

I am Banzo, the Neutral Hitman.

My wincon is taking out the three players I hate the most in this game: Ender, Shen, and Graff. When all three of those players are dead, I win. I have two abilities. The first is the ability to check a player once a night to find out their character name. The second is a one shot Night Kill. I can only use one of these abilities at the time.

Sesc motivated me Night 1, which made my one shot NK protection piercing, so I said what the hell and shot it. Probably not the smartest move, but whatever. Night 2, I checked Wetnurse's name and he proceeded to die. Then came Night 3, where I used the gun that Typhon gave me.

So here's the deal.

I'm 99% sure that Graff is a scum role. Think about it. Every single town player that's died so far has been a kid. In the book, adults were portrayed as the bad guys. Plus, it doesn't make sense for all three of the people I have to kill to be town. That would make things too easy for scum.

That means that my beef with town is over. Now here's the part where I tell you why you shouldn't kill me. Or more like why you can't kill me.

There are nine players alive right now. Considering everyone has a power role right now, and the third party team is only one person, I'm going with a 5 man scum team. 12 town/5 scum/1 third party. It makes some sense, especially if Typhon is scum with his +town ability.

If this is true, right now we're at 4 town/4 scum/1 third party. If you lynch me and scum gets off a kill tonight, which you know they will because Schro is now dead, tomorrow will be 3 town/4 scum. Game over.

If I'm wrong and it's only a 4 man scum team, the current count is 5 town/3 scum/1 third party. If you lynch me and they get off a night kill, tomorrow's count will be 4 town/3 scum. This puts you at LYLO. If you make a single mistake for the rest of the game, you're fucked.

Bottom line here? I'm pretty much vanilla town at this point, and you can't afford to kill me.

Now for this:

Lynch Vote: Typhon

His attitude has been bugging me since he revealed himself as gunsmith. He's been acting as if it's the only townfirm he needs, and if this were any other game I might be okay with that. But this is a closed setup, and every role has an ability, which causes imbalances in power.

My current theory is that there's a 5 man scum team. However, a 5 man scum team with all beneficial roles would be far too OP. This, combined with Typhon's comment that he "has to" give out his gun every night, makes me think it's a +town scum ability. His latest post has only cemented it for me. He questions me about why I shot bob99 over Caesar, as if he actually knew ahead of time that Caesar's claim wasn't legit. That makes no sense. Also, he says a player confirming they got a gun will assure everyone he's town, which once again shows his faulty logic.

Aekiel, take your vote off of Caesar, please. Even if we decide to lynch him later, right now there are enough scum to hammer that lynch and if town is lynched today you lose. This is end game, folks, and there's no room for error.

 

Hmm, knee jerk reaction wasn't a good one.

Okay, let's look at the worlds we have.

1) Caesar was telling the truth: Caesar is town, Menace and Typhon are scum. Typhon must have decided to give me a gun in place of his scum buddies. Menace received a gun despite being scum, therefore it makes no sense for Typhon to have given me a gun when he could give it to Rubicon or the potential fourth scum. This is effectively a paradox and is the least likely world to exist.

Actions to be taken: Lynch Menace to prove whether Caesar is telling the truth about there being two scum, followed by lynching Typhon.

2) Caesar was lying: Caesar is scum, Menace is town and Typhon is town. Typhon gives guns to me and Menace. We lynch Caesar and either rely on a traditional Cop coming forward or we lynch Menace as well, just in case. Same rules for Typhon and scumsmith as above.

Actions to be taken: Lynch Menace to check Caesar's declaration followed by lynching Caesar. Determine from there whether to lynch Typhon or not.

3) Caesar was lying: Caesar is scum, Menace is scum, Typhon is town. Scum react to the revelation of guns being given/used by turning it into a chance for them to kill off as many town as possible while sacrificing two of their own.

Actions to be taken: Lynch Menace, lynch Caesar.

4) Caesar was lying: Caesar is scum, Menace is town, Typhon is scum. Only slightly more likely to happen than #1.

Actions to be taken: Lynch Menace, lynch Caesar, lynch Typhon.

I put the order of likelihood to be 3>2>4>1. In which case our best bet is to lynch Menace to give us more information on whether Caesar is telling the truth or not. I'm leaning towards Caesar being scum and this being a failed gambit in reaction to the public call for gun owners to come forward.

 

Unvote until I can think a little more about what Menace said. 6 nontowns seems unlikely, but tempting fate is stupid.

 

Actually, you're not vanilla town. You're a third party that is one step away from winning the game. That makes you the greatest threat to town at this particular point in time.

---------- Post automerged at 06:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:44 PM ----------

Unvote
Vote: Menace

 

... Alright, I'll cut you some slack because I didn't explicitly state it in my post. But think about it. Why in the everloving fuck would Eido make it so that I could undermine the entire game by just killing three people?

I leave the game when I win, but the game still goes on. If scum wins and my targets aren't all dead by then, I lose. If town wins by killing all the scum, both myself and town wins.

 

Except I want town to win. Not third party.

 

I'm on the road now. I'll add real, thought out post when I get to the hotel.

 

Okay, no more slack. You are either scum, or you're being flat retarded. There is nothing stopping town and me from both winning. If you kill me today, town loses. Period. If your only reasoning for killing me is that you don't like the idea of anyone but town winning, even if town also wins along with me, then kill me, because you don't deserve to win.

---------- Post automerged at 06:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:54 PM ----------

That was at Aekiel. Also, Typhon, you can tell us who you gave the gun to now. I'd like you to do that, please. It's kinda important, and if you're not scum like I think you are there's no reason not to tell us.

 

No, you're thinking of this as a co-operative game between town and third party vs scum. It's not. It's town vs third party vs scum. That means you're just as much our enemy as the scum are and are, in fact, the closest to winning the game. It's not a matter of us winning along with you. It's a matter of you winning and us/scum losing.

I don't believe that scum started the game with five men. That would hilariously unbalance the game, especially with so many kills going on. Therefore this is damage control, ensuring that town has the best possible chance of winning the game. We lynch you, we go into LYLO.

As for Typhon, I'm inclined to leave him alive. If he's scum (not likely), he's being forced to give his guns to non-scum players. Therefore we have a method of townfirming people based on who he gives guns to. If he's scum and not limited to giving his guns to non-scum, he's an idiot. I consider this to be so unlikely as to be impossible.

Therefore he is either scum working in town's favour or he's town and can give his guns to confirmed town players. Therefore town gets one kill per day and one per night. That can work either for or against us, depending on who we hit.

So, I propose we lynch Menace now and have Typhon only give his guns to either myself or Stojil, whoever he feels most comfortable with giving the gun to.

 

THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT THIS IS.

I've killed both of my town targets already. I have no further desire to kill town. In fact, it is in my best interests to not kill town because if I do scum is likely to win before I can kill my last target. My last target who is fucking scum.

And once again, if it wasn't clear the first time, I leave the game when I win. The game does not end.

 

You're missing the point. It's not that the game ends when you win, it's that you win at all. There can only be one winner of the game. If town ends up beating scum after you win, that's still second place for us.

---------- Post automerged at 07:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:17 PM ----------

Anyway, I'm out for a drink now. I'll leave this to the rest of you for now.

 

I'm not sure that I trust what you have to say at all, Menace, because I think that if you really thought I was scum and your role is exactly as you say it is, you'd have killed Caesar on the chance he was telling the truth. Instead, you killed bob, who conveniently can't report who he tracked now (on that note: Karn. What is your role? Why me and Stojil? I need to know how you fit in, because Rents was scummy as all hell), and leaves you completely open to doubtcast me.

Due to my suspicions about you (although I can't cross check your posts yet; I have to get off my phone driving), I'll let them reveal. Your eagerness to know who it is makes me wonder if scum has a roleblocking ability and last night's kill didn't come from elsewhere. We'll see.

If nobody else finds that plausible, then I'll reveal when I make my longer post.

 

So you'd rather drastically increase your chances of losing than win after me.

... Fine. Kill me then. I hope you're confident in that 3 man scum team of yours.

 

Is it? Do you know this? If so, how?

Town winning alongside a third party is entirely plausible. There's no second place here, there is winning and there is not. If Menace is telling the truth, then he is no threat to town at this point, and targeting him over potential scum is stupid.

Can someone who is more familiar with the Ender's Game series corroborate what Menace says about Graff and Banzo?

 

I didn't think you were scum until it was revealed that bob99 was town. Now I think that, given the circumstances, it's far more likely that you're scum than Caesar being the ballsiest scum player I've ever seen. And I'm eager to know who you gave the gun to because I want that townfirm, and I'd rather you not try to hold onto it on the off chance that the player you gave it to doesn't speak up before day's end.

---------- Post automerged at 07:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:24 PM ----------

That was at Typhon. Blah, gotta start using quotes again.

 

Eidolonic refuses to answer me wrt win conditions and how they interact with other teams. I still think, though, that multiple teams winning is plausible. Consider that by N1 end we had 3 kills. I find it difficult to believe there's a mechanic that finishes the game by the end of the first night. That feels... broken.

Not saying I trust Menace, but Aekiel's kneejerk reaction somewhat worries me.

 

In regards to the Graff thing, it said in my flavor that on top of Ender I have to take down those who support him (Shen) and those who allowed this travesty to happen in the first place (Graff). So it makes sense.

 

Hmm. Extremely annoyed at myself for not sticking to my gut impression and lynching the fuck out of Typhon rather than Schro. Wish Menace had killed me instead of bob last night too. At least then you'd know I'm telling the truth.

Menace's third party claim makes sense too, especially as my role explicitly tells me the number of town on a wagon, rather than scum. Anyway, I'm certain that Typhon is scum and it's looking increasingly likely that Stojil's right about Aek. Anyway, I'm off to bed. I'll post more in the morning.

Vote Player: Typhon

 

Okay. I'm a little out of it, and I just have a phone for the next few days. Still, tomorrow I'll have both the time (my girlfriend has the seminar that we're in New Orleans for) and the mental capacity to respond. Expect me to be at least in the process of writing it within 12 hours.

 

I lost my post again and it was a huge one. Here's a somewhat shorter version of it.

Sir Karn and gun-holder: share.

Anyone with info: consider sharing.

Three existing worlds:

1) Caesar is scum.
a) He's scum with Menace.
b1) He's scum with Typhon and knew there was a third party in the group.
b2) He's scum with Typhon and didn't know there was a third party in the group.
c) He's scum with both.
d) He's scum with none of them.
2) Caesar is town, Menace is third party and Typhon is scum.
3) Caesar is town, Menace and Typhon are scum.

1) Very unlikely, IMO, all of the sub-points. Caesar's power is a townie one and I can't really see him make it and the result up when there was virtually no pressure on him. If he's scum and has that power, coming out with that result makes little sense in every world:

a) This is a bussing move. It's already risky and scum-damaging on its own. Why say there's 2 scum and face being outed instead of trying to take advantage of the bussing-towncred?
b1) This assumes scum!Caesar really has the townie power he says he has. In this case, he probably thought Schrodinger was the third party and he was very close to a lynch. Why buss Typhon? You can argue that outing Schrodinger was risky on its own, but odds were he would have been lynched immediately and whatever towncred he would have gained from it was enough.
b2) Same as point a.
c) Seriously? That would have been horrible.
d) Why risk such a bold lie? Again, saying the result was "1 scum" would have been better, but still pretty horrible. He would have known we would have lynched him or made sure he was saying the truth in some other way before actually risking to kill 2-3 townies.

One other possibility is: Caesar is scum and rolecopped Menace. This changes b1 and d a bit, but not much. Slightly more likely from a logical point of view, slightly less from a realistic one. He would have probably just outed Menace in a more straightforward way, if that had been the case.

2) Possible.
3) Likely.

Solution: lynch Typhon now, see if he's the guy Menace says he's after, consider what to do afterwards (hey there, Aekiel!).

Please, Eido, keep us updated on the vote tally as often as you can, since we're in a crucial and delicate part of the game. People, look out for scum-moves to lynch townies and end day early. Hard lynch is only at 5 votes.

Menace: I think a scum team of 5 players + 1 third party is very unlikely.
Aekiel: Menace winning doesn't look like town losing (I would have written "us losing", but, you know... ). Not directly anyway. Maybe if he exits the game and stops being a "town" vote for us, but I'm not buying third party yet.